Program Change CC Number?

#21

Midi monitor reports this:

18:58:36.274 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select 0
18:58:36.274 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
18:58:36.274 From X-TOUCH MINI Program 1 1
18:58:38.027 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select 0
18:58:38.027 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
18:58:38.027 From X-TOUCH MINI Program 1 127
18:58:39.058 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select 0
18:58:39.058 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
18:58:39.058 From X-TOUCH MINI Program 1 2
18:58:39.813 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select 0
18:58:39.813 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
18:58:39.813 From X-TOUCH MINI Program 1 126
18:58:41.977 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select 0
18:58:41.977 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
18:58:41.977 From X-TOUCH MINI Program 1 3
18:58:42.726 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select 0
18:58:42.726 From X-TOUCH MINI Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
18:58:42.726 From X-TOUCH MINI Program 1 125

So Inc/+1 gives 1, 2, 3 while Dec/-1 gives 127, 126, 125

Makes sense why Dec/-1 is being ignored as there are no patches with those numbers in the patchbank. Not sure how to get around that :confounded:

#22

Comparing this to the program change via my Nord (which does let me move through the indexed patches on the Axoloti) I get this:

19:06:54.365 From MIDI Port Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
19:06:54.366 From MIDI Port Program 1 1
19:06:56.823 From MIDI Port Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
19:06:56.824 From MIDI Port Program 1 2
19:06:58.496 From MIDI Port Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
19:06:58.497 From MIDI Port Program 1 3
19:06:59.820 From MIDI Port Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
19:06:59.821 From MIDI Port Program 1 2
19:07:01.116 From MIDI Port Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
19:07:01.116 From MIDI Port Program 1 1
19:07:07.710 From MIDI Port Control 1 Bank Select (fine) 0
19:07:07.711 From MIDI Port Program 1 0

So an increment is 1, 2, 3 and decrement is 3, 2, 1 and so on... So that's the behaviour I need to set up on the X-Touch. Some how...

#23

Maybe not very helpful; also don't a X Touch mini; sometimes it's just the obvious.

MIDI monitor is a savior :wink:

#24

Yeah, I'm not sure if it's possible to change the behavior of the Behringer to stop it from starting the "Dec/-1" from 127. Such a strange setup... Surely if you're on program 5 and you hit a -1 decrement you want it to go to 4 and not 127??

Think I'm going to have to build a box with just +1 and -1 program change buttons on it, make life easier :grinning:

#25

Axoloti has two tiny switches that can be used to good effect for program change :smile: I have started with them.

Nowadays I'm settling with either old iPhone or iPad via midi, dealing with program change; will probably add some more virtual knobs/sliders.

#26

Yeah, I thought about using those but they're too small really... How would you patch a program change using them, just out of interest?

#27

This was a bit crude and way back (January)

Lots have changed, but i'm sure it can be done...

edit: was manual patch adding this and jumping from one to the next, ahah inventions.

#28

Going back to X Touch, just an idea, can you have example CC 14 incrementaly up and down?
maybe instead of sending Midi Program Change messages to Axo, we could send in a CC to have patch up/down.

In the X Touch Editing screen you have Type: (change this to CC)
and
MIN VALUE - Inc/+1
MAX VALUE - Dec/-1
is that it?

#29

Sadly not... Nice idea but the Dec/-1 still throws out values starting at 127 working backwards.

This displays exactly the right counting behavior, with Inc/+1 on CC17 and Dec/-1 on CC27:

But it doesn't work when I use it as a controller object or even inserting it as a sub patch into each patch in the patchbank. It moves to the first one in the patchbank on an incremental press and then gets stuck.

#30

yes, this is due to the fact the counter does not retain its count, when you load a new patch. (counters are initialised to zero when they load) . I had pointed this out, when this was discussed some time back.
this was one of the reasons johannes has the new patch banks in 1.0.8

(to do it yourself, as I said above, would require more functions, with some way of maintain counts across patch loads, or someway for the patch to know is filename, and then use the file sytem on the sd card to step through patches)

x-touch, unfortunately, the manual is dreadful, so without the device its impossible to say if or how its configurable to do what you want.

#31

I got on to Behringer and asked them if it was possible to set a max / min or starting value for the program change increments and they've confirmed that it's not editable at this point. Wrong tool for this particular job evidently.

I'll experiment more with using specific file names rather than using the patch banks.

#32

So, the work-around with this particular controller is to have this stored as a controller object:

And assign a specific Program Change number to it's own pad rather that use the Inc/Dec function. So momentary button 1 has a Program Change value of 1, button 2 is Program Change 2 etc etc.

This is actually a bit more flexible than Inc/Dec as it means I can jump from patch 1 to patch 6 without stepping through the patches in between.

I still think the Inc/Dec function on the controller is very odd, but the above is a good solution for me. Thanks for all your help on this thread, very much appreciated.